Quote of the day

From Gail Collins on our soon-to-be-former president:

The man has been saying goodbye for so long, he’s come to resemble one of those reconstituted rock bands that have been on a farewell tour since 1982.

Hehe. And the kind of fate I hope the “new” Gaither Vocal Band avoids.

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  1. GospelMusicFan wrote:

    “Still spinning til to what you want to hear and think”

  2. marie hardy wrote:

    Those of you who are “Bush bashers” just remember this. NO attacks on our soil for his eight years. The financial mess we are in is directly traceable to Pres Bill Clinton who, during his two terms, ordered banks to lend to the poor and those who couldn’t afford a house. They were MANDATED by the federal govt to loan money to these folks who are now in default. Also, at congressional hearings about the mess at FNMA and Freddie Mac over three years ago, two prominent Democrats, the infamous Barney (resident gay member of congress) and Maxine Waters are on tape saying there was “no problem” with them. They tabled any investigation into these two organizations over three years ago when this mess could have been avoided. The liberal “pravda” press doesn’t want you to know this, but if you google or you tubed it, you will find the exact hearings to which I refer. I am disappointed in Bush for many reasons, but mainly because he campaigned as a conservative and governed as a liberal. The election of Barack Obama is only the beginning of sorrows for this nation. More taxes, gays serving openly in the military will decimate them. Thousands will leave in protest. ALL abortion restrictions will be lifted because Obama believes in infanticide. He voted for it in Illinois before he became a US Senator. More government led by radicals Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid will finish off this once great nation because we are arrogant, proud, and don’t need God anymore. He will politely leave us to our own demise.

  3. rr wrote:

    Enough! Let the man alone! He’s a good man, and he has had the most difficult presidency that I know of. He is not to blame for everything bad that happens, like libs like to believe.

  4. DMP wrote:

    You know, some of you people who sit on her criticizing Gaither and his music remind me of the fat guy in his 40’s that sits at every high school basketball game in America, telling the kids they need to learn how to “hustle.”

    “Let the excellence of your work be your protest.”

  5. ricky davis wrote:

    I’m new here, but I’m gonna stick my neck out here.

    Funny how folks cry foul about torturing terrorists, and turn around and kick a crippled man.

    These same hypocrits bashed Beloved Bush for a 40 million dollar presidential party are silently watching the little “m” messiah and his cronies spend over three times that much on his. I don’t have a problem with that, as honoring the president (no matter who he is) is noble and truly American. I am like a silent majority of conservatives who honestly, and sincerely pray that the new president will be the most successful and best ever, even if he does play for the other team.

    And, the disrespect for Mr. Gaither (who single handedly provided the cure for the terminally ill Southern Gospel world) is also mind boggling! He made yet another brilliant move and the naysayers sound like billygoats on steroids. Godspeed Mr. Bush, and Mr. Gaither! Bush to restful retirement, Bill to new heights and a new decade of well attended concerts of the finest Southern Gospel Music ever!

  6. Daniel J. Mount wrote:

    The credit goes to the Constitutional Amendment inspired by FDR and passed in the 50s or so that makes him a lame duck for his last 4 years.

  7. Brian wrote:

    It’s easy to be critical. It’s easy to be immature and resort to name calling. It’s easy to go with what the current flow is. It’s easy to rehash the same deragatory comments that have been circulating the media. So the article, which I am a little suprised was even published, written by Gail Collins was a simple minded, easy thing to do.

    However, it takes courage to lead in a time of trouble. When everything in your being is telling you to run, to go and huddle with your family and hope the “bad guys” don’t come to your house.It takes courage to stand in the face of adversity, even when much of the adversity comes from within your own borders, comes from within your own press corps. Don’t believe for one minute that these last years have been easy for President Bush, and that he has just red-necked his way through this. The fact that this most brilliant journalist was able to write her opinions, is a testimony to the work the he and countless others have done and the sacrifices of so many who have given their lives to insure that she gets to voice her opinion, in English, I might add.
    It also takes courage to go before a nation that you have lead for the last eight years, that absolutely lambasts you at every turn and say “thank you for the opportunity to serve”. It takes courage to go before that same nation of ungratefuls and admit that mistakes were made and there were things I would have done differently. President Bush was not perfect, he was far from the greatest President we have ever had, but I don’t believe and Gail Collins or anyone else for that matter cannot convince me that President Bush ever had anything but this nation in the forefront of every decision made. I cannot defend some of the decisions made but I would gladly stand with him, which takes courage, and not join in the childish tearing down of a man.

    Thank You President Bush!!

  8. nonsgfan wrote:

    Thank you Marie Hardy. The banking world was indeed mandated to give to people who they knew couldnt afford it. They call it “Fair Lending”. It worked out okay from carter to Bush 1, but when Clinton amended it, it began the cycle.

    What people fail to mention about bush is that 1 MILLION jobs were LOST on 9-11. The 9-11 tragedies were PLANNED during the CLINTON years, not the Bush Years, and Bush is the only President in history to take an economy that lost 1 MILLION jobs, and restore it back to some sort of health.
    He wasnt great…but he wasnt terrible.

    As for Gaither…the main problem people have with him is jealousy. Every single thing that he pours out of his brilliant mind turns to Gold and people cannot stand that.

    get over it..

  9. Jim2 wrote:

    I actually clicked through and read the whole article. As an Op-Ed column, it reinforces my belief in opinions - insert your cliche about them being like armpits whatever. I think as time rolls on, she’ll find out that in fact the press did “misunderestimate” the President - and there’s my stinky opinion.

  10. Lonnie Hall wrote:

    “NO attacks on our soil for his eight years.”
    Except for 9/11/2001, I guess you’re right. That’s kind of a big one to ignore, though.

  11. marie hardy wrote:

    Lonnie Hall, yes, it was on Bush’s watch. It was nine months after he took office. He inherited a wimpy, limp-wristed foreign policy of Bill Clinton/Madeline Albright who wanted to treat every attack with UN sanctions. That really led to 9/11. However, you can’t deny Bush has forcefully gone after Al Queda and decimated them around the world. I look forward to seeing how the pacifist Obama handles a renewed and more powerful Al Queda with a willing and supportive Democrat congress.

  12. Mark wrote:

    marie-I love that you call Obama a pacifist. Yet you fail to see that our savior was very much a pacifist (i.e, turn the other cheek…those who live by the sword… etc.,). How is it that Christians fail to see the that Christ’s example was non-violence? No where in his life did he ever find it necessary to use violent force towards others to make his point. It really is amazing how quickly we support a war that has not been all that it was cracked up to be in spite of Christ’s call to non-violence.

  13. Lonnie Hall wrote:

    Sounds to me like you should’ve run for president, Ms. Hardy. It must be frustrating being an armchair quarterback. I guess we all have those missed glaringly obvious opportunities, though, don’t we?

  14. Jake wrote:

    Thank you, President Bush, for being a man of conviction and sticking to your convictions, even when the liberal (and sometimes downright evil) naysayers had nothing good to say about you and the people of our nation disrespected you and turned against you for doing much more than the liberal media will give you credit for.

    Thank you, Mr. Gaither, for the blessing you have been to countless thousands (if not millions) both by your written and performed music and by putting other people onto a platform where they can be a blessing to others too.

    Thank you, Marie and rr and GMP and Ricky and Daniel and Brian and nonsgfan, together with anyone and everyone else who reacts to the heartless words which began this thread — Thank you for sticking up for these two men who have faced the odds, done their best, and performed valiently.

    Thank you

  15. NG wrote:

    A recent Gallup poll showed a mere 17% of Americans believe George W. Bush will go down in history as an outstanding or above-average president. Another 23% of Americans predict he will be remembered as “average” while 59% say “below average” or “poor.

    Appears Avery’s posts mainly attract those folks in the 17 per cent group.

  16. Steve wrote:

    Marie, ift it’s a “renewed and more powerful
    Al Queda” Obama is inheriting, that happened on Bush’s watch. The Republicans were effective with Clinton because they held his feet to the fire on taxes and spending. The U.S. was ruuning a surplus. Bush and a Republican Congress lost their economic principles and we are paying a price. You can blame Clinton,
    Bush, Democrats, Obama or whoever,
    but we got to this point collectively as a people. We all wanted cheaper goods so we could have more. The Chinese provided them and we took the bait. Now we have very few manufacturing jobs left in this country to help lead us out of the difficulties we are in.

    Daniel J Mount is very simplistic to blame 4 years of being a lame duck on FDR. Ronald Reagan accomplished more even with the Iran Contra affair. Bush should have fired Rumsfeld long before he did. He sat idly by the last 4 years because he had lost credibility with the American people. Few believed what he was saying. I was one of them and I voted for him twice. He is a great human being but a disappointment as President. I also wonder why DJM brings his sarcasm here but does not allow similar things on his site in order to keep it “positive.”

    I did not vote for Obama. I did pray that the man of God’s choosing would be elected. I have to accept the results as that being God’s will and pray for the man.

  17. BaritioneBob wrote:

    # 8 nonsgmusicfan, not “everything” turns to Gold. Google “Celebration Theatre” in Branson Missouri 1992 and you will find out there were some failures as well that Bill does’nt want to be reminded of.

  18. marie hardy wrote:

    Steve, the “renewed and more powerful Al Queda” hasn’t happened yet. Mark my words, it WILL happen with Obama as President. When he changes the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy against gays in the military, we will lose at least 10% of our armed forces. I would love to be a pacifist but when someone is attacking my family or my homeland, I will fight back. I not perfect as Jesus was. I imagine most Christians would try to defend themselves if they or their children were threatened. What people seem to forget is Al Queda responds only to power. You can try to reason with them until you’re blue in the face but they only respect power. Bush brought them to their knees, and they don’t wind up there very often. They will regroup under a US President who doesn’t see the danger of a “renewed and more powerful” enemy.

  19. Andrew S. wrote:

    Sounds like the rock band could be classified as Naomi & the Segos…lol

  20. Videoguy wrote:

    You mean Obama isn’t the president yet?

  21. j-mo wrote:

    Jake - I doubt Bush or Gaither read the comments section of this blog, so it might be best for you to redirect your accolades.

    Marie - you’re not as perfect as Jesus was, but shouldn’t you strive to be? You’re not really even trying if you’ve already resolved to live your life by a different set of principals than he did.

  22. nonsgfan wrote:

    Mark, first of all…..Christ was a pacifist in “personal situations”..not one time did he talk against war of nations when it’s necissary. As a matter of fact..
    Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make WAR.

    does that sound like a pacifist to you? naaaah.

    Also, Baritonebob…MY BAD, that ole’ Gaither, gosh darnit…I FORGOT THAT ONE! LoL.

    Sorry, all the gaither-waives of success that were overwhelming me caused me to lose sight of that little ripple of defeat in the waters of southern gospel history.



  23. Mark wrote:

    Maria-You have just demonstrated the reality of the “Myth of Redemptive Violence”. It is this thinking that keeps the cycle going. They attacked us (in their minds I’m sure they were justified), we attack back (justified of course), they are regrouping to attack again, which in turn we will ATTACK BACK. Everyone feels justifed in attacking if they’ve been attacked. Jesus’ words “those who live by the sword, die by the sword” allude to that reality. As a church we really should have the belief that what scripture teaches us about Christ is more important and capable of changing the world than US Military force.

  24. Mark wrote:

    …and I’ve just realized I am way off topic. Sorry about that.

  25. Irishlad wrote:

    Look Gaither didn’t invent Sg and i’m sure didn’t plan that 1st taping,but,what he did have was a brilliant ‘product’ to exploit and maximise. He couldn’t have done it with any other genre of Christian music. What he had was the original and best,he just gave it the kiss of life.

  26. K.D. wrote:

    To Mark
    Did Jesus turn the other cheek when he cleansed the temple?

  27. marie hardy wrote:

    Mark, I suppose that means you have no guns in your home for protection. That’s very laudable but foolish. I was speaking of protection for my family, not justifying the Iraq war. I personally think it was a mistake to liberate those people who really don’t know what to do once they are liberated. That being said, I think God would have us protect our children from invaders or intruders who would seek to do harm to our family.

  28. american wrote:

    #15, Jake, thank you!

  29. american wrote:

    I meant #14. My apologies

  30. nonsgfan wrote:

    K.D…….you stole my post.

    Christ was angry and violent when he cleansed the temple.

    Not sure how I can compare the cleansing of the temple to the iraq war….wait..I know….

    Violence in war is not spoken AGAINST in the bible, and Christ was only a pasifist in matters of personal conduct.

    Not war.

  31. SGfan wrote:

    Well, this is interesting. Doug picks yet another lune to source. How typical is that?

    Now to those that are having the discussion about turning the other cheek (Mark). Please quit using scripture out of context. However, to use the analogy of turning the other cheek, at what point do we run out of cheeks to turn? After all, the 9/11 attack on the World Trade Center was the second attack on that particular location alone, not counting the USS Cole and other embassy attacks. There is no “Myth of Redemptive Violence” there. We tried your way of passiveness under Clinton, and you see what it led to. We have been on the offensive under Bush (since 9/11) and you see we have not had an attack. Which policies had better results? Furthermore, you mention them attacking us back. That will only happen if we allow them to rebuild and do not complete the mission of destroying their ability to do so. We do have to start exposing them to the love of Christ, but we can not do that without first breaking down the oppressive regimes that are founded in a religion that will not allow us to share that. I guess Bush said it best last night.

    “I have often spoken to you about good and evil. This has made some uncomfortable. But good and evil are present in this world, and between the two there can be no compromise. Murdering the innocent to advance an ideology is wrong every time, everywhere. Freeing people from oppression and despair is eternally right. ”

    Maybe you don’t agree with that, but if your family is buried in the rubble following a terrorist attack during the Obama administration, are you going to be as quick to preach passivism? I would venture to bet the opposite. I know I would not be so passive in my approach. God never forbids his people to protect themselves. If He did, He would have to apologize for a lot that happened in the Old Testament during the early years of the Israelites. He will also have a lot to apologize for during the fulfilling of the Revelation and end time prophecies. Bottom line, quit using scripture out of context. Learn what it really means.

  32. John wrote:

    QUOTE Mark: “How is it that Christians fail to see the that Christ’s example was non-violence? No where in his life did he ever find it necessary to use violent force towards others to make his point.”

    My friend, you show a lack of knowledge. Fact is, that last sentence is utter hogwash.

    As someone else already pointed out, Jesus DID use violence against a group of people. He took a whip, and he cleaned house! VIOLENCE!!!

    Matthew 10:34
    Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

    Jesus was not a sad sack wimp. Quite the opposite.

  33. Bob M. wrote:

    There are those who choose to criticize Bill Gaither. Some see him as someone who just ‘latched on’ to SG in the mid 90’s in order to make a buck. Bill grew up with SG of the 40’s and 50’s. People like Jake Hess were his heroes. However, as his trio became more known, he was at the forefront of what became contemporary christian music in the early 70’s. As a songwriter and performer with the BG Trio (Bill, Gloria, his brother Danny and later, Gary McSpadden), Gaither was one of the leaders of the early CCM movement. Even with the formation of the Gaither Vocal Band around 1980 or 81, he remained very much in the contemporary genre. In 1991, as a tribute to his SG heroes, the Vocal Band recorded an album titled “Homecoming.” It was well received. He followed it up in 92, which was a fortuitous decision, because CCM was in the process of leaving behind the “inspirational” sound of people like Sandi Patty, Steve Green, Larnelle Harris, and the like, including GVB. By 95 the CCM change in sound was complete; Gaither no longer was welcome in CCM. As an astute businessman, not only was he returning to his roots (SG), but he saw the potential for continuing to earn a good living. The nostalgia craze hit America during the 90’s, and touched every area of life, including SG music. Bill not only was giving honor to his heroes, but capitalizing on the craze that was taking place in the culture. GVB transitioned into SG, and Gaither is responsible for taking SG to new heights; not unlike how NASCAR was regional until Jeff Gordon hit the circuit, and before long, NASCAR was a national hit. Gaither helped to revitalize SG music at a time when it was sorely needed. Now, some 15 years later, it may be fashionable to criticize, but those who do it now are just jealous. Because of Bill Gaither, SG music is now more acccessible to more people than ever before. To me, that is a good thing. Are there still problems? Of course. Is SG perfect? Far from it. Is SG being used of God, and does the music glorify and bring honor and praise to Him? Most definitely.

    Bill Gaither is not the problem with SG music. If Doug would care to write an essay, in layman’s terms, about SG’s problems, great. The problem is, each one of us with a pc who reads blogs, believe that OUR opinion is the only correct one. Can’t wait for heaven, where we will learn THE TRUTH.

  34. K.D. wrote:

    To SGfan #31post

  35. nonsgfan wrote:

    Well said Bob M.

    Besides, I highly doubt anything Gaither has one in the past 20 years has hardly been for “Money”.

    I think he’s PROOOBBABBBLLLY got PLENTY by now.

  36. Stace wrote:

    Are you guys comparing George Bush to Jesus or Bill Gaither Barack Obama? This one has gotten me all confused!

  37. GospelMusicFan wrote:

    Nothing that has been stated here by some on this thread is really any new material.
    Just the same old stuff spinning it any way to suit your fancy notion of wisdom.
    So it is my turn to do some spinning:
    “Being popular in this world isn’t the ultimate goal in life but doing what is right to all is an unattainable goal.”
    “I have come to a conclusion that you must be doing something right if you have your fair share of over the line critics bent on a mission of destruction.”
    Wish you well George W. Bush and may God bless Bill Gaither and all his friends.

  38. Angie M wrote:

    #11: Do the letters PDB mean anything to you?

  39. JM wrote:

    Folks, folks, folks!

    Everybody calm down and put away your unkind thoughts. Apparently, our blog host has run out useful and impactful topics with which to evoke intellegent dialogue. My experience tells that mentioning George Bush or Bill Gaither on this blog is akin to tossing a firebomb into a crowded theatre. Much noise, confussion and injury. Our host is keenly aware of this and deftly uses quotes from others to stimulate a flash-fire of unkind verbage. The unifying element between Mrs. Bush and Gaither is that history will determine how they will be remembered. And while I have my own opinion on both, 25-50 years from now, both will be more accurately evaluated through the prism of time and wisdom. I’ve never given much value to Monday Morning Quarterbacks. Unfortunately, it’s predictable that 12-24 months from now, this blog will pursue topics such as: Has the new GVB flopped and why? or Will President Obama’s Middle East policy spell doom for more black Americans looking to run for President? Cheap theatrics reflecting the demise of a once useful blog. RIP.

  40. AnnD wrote:

    Anything from the New York Times is suspect to me…ad

  41. WA wrote:

    We Americans have the world’s most notoriously short attention span when it regards history. And, as unpopular as it may be to write this, I have no doubt but that future historians will be vastly kinder to this President Bush than the pundits of today have been. I’ve personally been disappointed with some of his decisions, especially in the last four years. But, regardless of what we think of him, he’s taken every hit, never whined, treated with class those who have been his greatest detractors, and endured eight years of the most difficult presidency of my lifetime. He’s been a stand-up guy, an optimist, and again, we’ve been kept safe since 9/11. I doubt that will remain true for long. I may not miss all of his decisions, but I sure will miss him. The man waiting in the wings is a shadow of the man we’ve had. Most just don’t know it yet. With a Teleprompter, he gives fine and eloquent speeches. Without one, we’re subjected to vague and rambling discourses, and more “Ummms” and “Uhhs” than I’ve ever heard. Hopefully he’ll be able to grow into the hardest job on earth, after zero experience as an executive and decision maker. I pray that he will. Hopefully he’ll become more of a pragmatist and leave behind many of the shallow promises that he made as a candidate. I pray that he will. And hopefully, he’ll find the Lord while he’s in office. I pray for that too.

    As for Mr. Gaither, it’s all jealousy here. His track record is unlike any other. He and Gloria have kept the church singing for decades. They’re gifts to the church. Agree or disagree with anything about them, that’s fine. Opinions are always subjective. Sure - there are people who have never been on a DVD that I would have loved to see, and some that I still have no idea why they’re on any of the projects at all. But, the sum of them, and the HC concerts, have been a real blessing to millions, all around the world. And at the end of the day, that counts for something.

    Farewell, President Bush, and best wishes in your retirement. And to Mr. Gaither, keep doing what you’ve done so well. True leaders don’t lead based on the kinds of comments represented here…they lead when their heart tells them to take a certain course of action. They live with their decisions, and even with their regrets. And that is infinitely harder than sniping from a distance, by those who have never been there, and never will be.

  42. GospelMusicFan wrote:

    There are a lot of people who travel the countryside that should be aware of the awesome power of the press of the New York Times Co.
    The state of Florida is loaded up with the more progressive newspapers.
    We should give the Worcester Telegram & Gazette a season of grace from the guilty by association mentality as the Worcester, MA newspaper gives good press coverage when Bill Gaither & Friends come to central New England.
    You can tell your kind of newspaper by reading the front page headlines.
    A newspaper who is more interested in the life of Karl Marx than the life of Jesus Christ would be suspect.
    By the way, the Boston Globe is on the suspect list but I still read the suspect newspaper.
    Times are tough right now for the New York Times.
    They are even trying to sell their 17.5 share of the Boston Red Sox.

  43. Barney wrote:

    To Marie # 27

    I carry the “ol persuader” for protection but I keep the bullet in my pocket.

    Plaxico Burress should have done likewise.

  44. Jim E. Davis wrote:

    Really. I think we should all be weary of our incoming president saying “hello”.

  45. AnnD wrote:

    Yeah #41….if a conservative stuttered around as much as the President elect does, he or she would be crucified as being illiterate. Sometimes I want to scream “JUST SAY IT AND QUIT BEING A DRAMA KING”, which I think a part of that is about.

  46. WA wrote:

    Yep, AnnD…much has been made (even here) with Pres. Bush’s malaprops and his occasional lack of eloquent speech. Many (even here) have called him stupid, an embarrassment, etc. I honestly wonder where they are after listening to our soon- to-be-President after one of his many rambling remarks, punctuated by so many of his stutters. It’s gonna be a long four years! As for the “drama” remark, when he began to hold his daily press conferences the day after the election, (a first) standing behind that podium bearing the sign - complete with a near-seal - proclaiming “The Office Of The President-Elect”, it’s all the drama anyone needs! LOL

    And then, of course, Doug is enthralled with the pageantry leading up to the grand ceremonies of tomorrow. And, I guess so. Estimates are that we the taxpayers will be shelling out $158 mil for them all, when the most-expensive one prior to tomorrow was has cost $42 million! I won’t be watching any of it.

  47. marie hardy wrote:

    The MSM and the liberals have made life miserable for Pres Bush for eight long years. He has been ridiculed, badmouthed, and maligned for his entire presidency. They have attacked his every move and have resisted every attempt at reconciliation. Now they want a love fest and bi-partisanship. The only thing is, bi-partisanship to the Dems is “their way or the highway”. Bush has made some mistakes in judgment but he loves his country and he has kept us safe. I hope you Barack supporters will remember these days. As bad as they are, the Dems, NOT Bush, got us here. And under Obama, they will get worse. Clinton MANDATED loans to the poor for housing. The banks were forced to make bad loans. Now we taxpayers must bail them out. The House panel on banking three years ago defended FNMA and Freddie Mac, and Maxine Waters and Barney Frank, are on tape defending them. All investigations were stopped by these Dems.
    Barack Obama and his ilk are now in charge. With the MSM completely in the tank for them, you will not get any negative press or thorough investigations of an improprieties.
    If they think I will just lie down and take their socialist agenda for this nation, they had better think again. I love my country too much to see a young, brash, cocky president who hasn’t a clue about what it takes run this country, run it in the ground. We will see very soon his agenda for us. There is talk of removing the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy so that gays may openly serve. Just what do you think that will do to morale when the soldier in a foxhole or close quarters with an openly gay partner who is more interested in him than in fighting Al Queda? IF Obama does this, there is talk of at least 10% of soldiers who will NOT re-inlist. IF he does as he says and removes all restrictions on abortion, we will begin to see the beginning of the end of this nation. He will try to take this country the way of Great Britain and it’s socialism. I have been there and they are overrun with Muslim immigrants. It’s awful! That country is lost. It’s not if but when. We are already overrun with Mexican illegal immigrants. I’m sorry to sound so glum but right now we are having mass celebrations in Washington for libs. Nancy Pelosi is one of the most radical people in the House and she is speaker. She has shut down all Republican ammendments to bills she and the Dems will propose. Republicans will not be able to debate the fine points of the legislation she introduces for votes. What kind of legislation do you think we will get with her and the “change you can believe in” president?

  48. JLL wrote:

    The other party always makes life miserable for whatever party is in office, don’t they? Conservative Republicans didn’t stop bashing Clinton from Whitewater to Lewinsky, and the Liberals did the same thing to George W. Bush. Until we all can come together and work for the common good, nothing will ever change.

    “Just what do you think that will do to morale when the soldier in a foxhole or close quarters with an openly gay partner who is more interested in him than in fighting Al Queda?”

    Oh, Marie! That statement is clear evidence that you know nothing about gay people whatsoever. To jump to the conclusion that a gay soldier will be interested in just ANYONE of the same sex is ludicrous and demeaning–not to mention downright ignorant.

    What a pity that you cannot hope for the best, pray for our new administration and bring something positive to the discussion.

    “Bitter–party of one? Your table is ready!!!”

  49. Wade wrote:

    JLL… thanks for chiming in… but beware they fuddies don’t like it when you call BS on them!! But welcome to the hate club… it is really funny!!! Just watch’em!!

  50. marie hardy wrote:

    JLL, tell me about gay people, please since you seem to know so much.

  51. JLL wrote:

    Why, Marie? So that I can make broad generalizations about gay people as you have done? No, thank you. Every gay person is different from the others, as is every heterosexual person.

    Besides, a very wise (and VERY politically incorrect) once told me that picking a fight on the internet is like [edit]. God bless.

  52. DMP wrote:

    Why is it Marie that you assume all gay men are attracted to every man they see? Are you?

  53. cynical one wrote:

    Would these comments about gay men in the fox hole be any more valid than straight men and women servicing together in the fox hole?

    Just wondering.

  54. marie hardy wrote:

    DMP and JLL, thank you for enlightening me on the proclivities of gay men. I simply had no idea. I am not around gay people, so their night life and their gay bars are simply of no interest to me. I attend church on Sunday where I fellowship with like believers in the risen Christ. You know, the one who said to the woman caught in adultery, “Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more”. It´s that last statement that is kind of a tough one for gays I would think.
    I was assuming what I had read a few times that many gays frequent gay bars to pick up new lovers as they generally can never get enough. That may not be true for you. So sorry to put you in that catagory. By the way, why are you posting on here anyway? Do you feel it necessary to enlighten Christians? Is it more noble if you have but one lover you live with and perhaps wish to marry?
    Oh, and by the way, I went the conventional route. I married and have three wonderful children. I don´t know. I just had this notion that when God said “Be fruitful and multiply”, that was His will and plan and that´s what He meant. That´s just an aside but something gays simply can´t do without the help of some hetersexual along the way.

  55. Wade wrote:

    Marie… I’d turn down the smart ass a little it will come back and bite ya… if you have 3 kids there’s a real good chance one of them will be gay!!

    Plus while you are showing your ignorance you seem to be VERY INTERESTED!!! lol

    I know gay couples that have been together 20 + years. They are no more inclined to, “generally can never get enough”, than MANY Hetro’s. Who also frequent bars & churches on their SEARCH for MORE… bet a few are even in that church you go to… they might even also be, “like believers in the risen Christ.”

  56. JLL wrote:

    You know, I tried to take my own advice and just shut up, but I can’t.

    Marie, I did find it amusing that because DMP and I challenged some of your generalizations about gays, you assumed we were gay ourselves (”So sorry to put you in that catagory”). I cannot speak for DMP, but in my case, yes, you’re right…good call!

    Please don’t believe everything about gay people that you read or see on television. Not all of us have rainbow flags flying from our houses. We don’t all dress in drag or leather and parade down the street hoping to shock people such as yourself. As for gays frequenting “gay bars to pick up new lovers as they generally can never get enough…” I think that could apply to much of the bar-hopping, promiscuous heterosexual crowd as well. Sinning no more is probably tough for all of us, wouldn’t you agree? It may comfort you to know that the night life and the gay bars are of no interest to me either. I read my Bible every day (along with my Corrie Ten Boom “Each New Day” devotional)! I spend each and every Saturday evening watching the “Gaither Gospel Hour” on RFD-TV! Immediately after that, there’s another Gaither program on my local Public Television station! Then I watch Lawrence Welk, unless the Hoppers or the Perrys are on “Gospel Music Southern Style” on INSP! Woo hoo! Party on!

    As for why I am posting here–maybe you think I wouldn’t or shouldn’t be interested in reading a blog such as this, but I am. My family has deep roots in the church and in southern gospel, so it is a topic that interests me. I am interested in everyone’s point of view, but when I read statements such as yours it saddens me and makes me feel alienated and rejected by the church and the faith I hold so dear. I do not feel it necessary to “enlighten Christians” but I guess I did feel it necessary to try to enlighten you. My apologies to you if you feel I crashed the party, and my apologies to the other posters for derailing the thread. I’ll make you a deal, Marie–I’ll pray for you, you pray for me! God bless.

  57. tinamarie wrote:

    JLL, I appreciate your candor. I must say, if it is a heterosexual frequenting a bar looking for women or a homosexual looking for sex, they are BOTH wrong. This is Not God´s plan for a mutal loving relationship. This is pure, unadulterated LUST. Sinning no more is a tough one. But justifying sin because one was born that way, is no excuse. Everyone must fight his or her own demons. To just give in and use that excuse is really no excuse at all.
    I must say that watching the Gaither gospel is good, watching Lawrence Welk is ok. What does that have to do with your eternal soul and salvation? Music has always soothed the soul but it does not save us. Bowing your knee in submission to the risen Christ and saying Yes to His Lordship is what saves us. Dying to self makes you alive to Christ. Paul is very plain on this. Do you spend as much time in the scripture as you do watching Gaither on TV?
    I am glad you care enough to post but sad that you feel alienated. Everyone is welcome at the table of grace when we bow in submission to the Lordship of Christ. We are saying “Lord I love you more than my own self will and am willing to die to myself to gain your favor. He loves you more than you love yourself and desires a deep fellowship with you. HOWEVER, it can´t be on your terms. It has to be on His terms. He is the creator God. He sets up kings and puts down the proud and arrogant. I hope you know that I don´t condemn you. I have my own demons I deal with and fight this fight of faith every day. But you must fight it. Paul, at the end of his life said ” I have fought the good fight and I have kept the faith. Henceforth there is a crown of righteousness laid up for me in heaven”. I will pray for you in your fight and appreciate your prayers for me. I want to please my Lord more than anything else. He is such a good God and wants the very best for you and me. God bless you and give you power today to follow Him obediently.

  58. marie hardy wrote:

    Wade, I find your comments insulting and presumptive. Interested in what? To presume that since you are gay, one of my children is probably gay, is very sad. It seems you are resigned to yourself and justify it all by saying probably your children will be like me too. Very sad. We all make choices in life. That´t the beauty of free will that God gives us. You have made some bad choices. However, today´s a new day. You can make the right choice today.
    JLL, I will be praying for you. It seems like you struggle with this. You have a family that I am sure is praying too. We all have our demons we struggle with. Mine are no less powerful than yours. I will pray for you in your fight against the powers that come against you. Paul said at the end of his life, ” I have fought a good fight. I have kept the faith. Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness for those that love Him”. It all boils down to this. Do you love Him more than you love your life? I pray you do. It will mean the difference in eternal bliss with Him or eternal separation from Him. I want to make my eternal home with my God who loves me so much. He loves you just as much as me. You are in my prayers. Thank you so much for your prayers for me.

  59. marie hardy wrote:

    Wade and JLL, sorry for the typos. I´m overseas now and the keyboard is different here. I had two replys that came back. I prayed this one would go through. Please know that the love of Christ can change anyone who asks for change. Those who are content the way they are and feel no need for change don´t need a Savior. Just remember, God´s heart is moved by a humble and contrite spirit but He resists the proud and arrogant. God´s peace be with you today.

  60. JLL wrote:

    My choices in television-watching have nothing to do with the state of my eternal soul and salvation, and I am well aware of that. I mentioned that because Marie seemed to be insinuating that all gay people are partying, bar-hopping, promiscuous sex maniacs, and I used my recap of a “thrilling” Saturday night to assure her that her assumptions are definitely not true in my case.

    I struggle more with the attitudes of others than I struggle with my own salvation. I feel quite secure in that. God bless.

  61. Wade wrote:

    Hey Marie… I love Dr. DH and everything but if I were over seas I think I could find something better to do with my time than to post on a blog thread… but that just goes to show how sad your life is!!! lol

    Go spend time with those beautiful children and loving husband you have that should be keeping you busier!!

    But what will you do one day if one of them is gay??? There is a real good chance since you have 3 kids that one of them will be… I am just saying before you judge to much be careful it will bite ya!!!

    But to be clear I am Hetro no Homo and I bet you are a handful!! lol lol

  62. dmp wrote:

    The problem I have with your statements is that you come from the belief that homosexuality is a sin, which I’m not arguing. But your plan of making fun of them and berating them with demeaning remarks until they repent is a very flawed strategy. I have many gay friends I could never invite to my church because of these kinds of statements. It is one thing to believe it is a sin, it is entirely another to let your homophobic nature guide your moral compass.

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