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	<title>Comments on: Disintermediation, Pt 2</title>
	<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/</link>
	<description>Criticism and commentary on southern gospel music</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 18:53:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: ken</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-896439</link>
		<dc:creator>ken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 May 2009 03:32:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-896439</guid>
		<description>Singing News Top 5,its the same ones every year no matter who and how you vote,maybe thats why the NQC has become stagnant,same ones sings,same ones get awards,guess it will never change,but it goes on and on and on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Singing News Top 5,its the same ones every year no matter who and how you vote,maybe thats why the NQC has become stagnant,same ones sings,same ones get awards,guess it will never change,but it goes on and on and on.</p>
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		<title>By: quartet-man</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-895058</link>
		<dc:creator>quartet-man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 May 2009 14:30:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-895058</guid>
		<description>Part of singling (is that a word? :-)) is that people have different tastes in music. Sometimes they get it right, but very often  I prefer album cuts to those released as singles. This goes with many groups including some of my favorites such as the Oaks, Cathedrals, Gold City (I think) and others. But, on other hands, sometimes others love the singles the best. Sometimes though I have seen that the singles released didn't seem to do much for most people. I can't think of an example offhand.

On the opposite end, years ago the Oaks released "Change My Mind." This was one of the very best songs on the CD, if not THE best. I think it only lasted 5  weeks on the charts and peaked at #70.
Five years later, John Berry's FAR inferior version of the song went to #10.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Part of singling (is that a word? :-)) is that people have different tastes in music. Sometimes they get it right, but very often  I prefer album cuts to those released as singles. This goes with many groups including some of my favorites such as the Oaks, Cathedrals, Gold City (I think) and others. But, on other hands, sometimes others love the singles the best. Sometimes though I have seen that the singles released didn&#8217;t seem to do much for most people. I can&#8217;t think of an example offhand.</p>
<p>On the opposite end, years ago the Oaks released &#8220;Change My Mind.&#8221; This was one of the very best songs on the CD, if not THE best. I think it only lasted 5  weeks on the charts and peaked at #70.<br />
Five years later, John Berry&#8217;s FAR inferior version of the song went to #10.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Harris</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894598</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Harris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 18:18:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894598</guid>
		<description>MY comment was about:
"Scott Fowler, golden child of the Old Way"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MY comment was about:<br />
&#8220;Scott Fowler, golden child of the Old Way&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Wade</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894427</link>
		<dc:creator>Wade</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 05:56:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894427</guid>
		<description>Ben I have to agree with 4Given...sorry $Given... you are now forever soiled!! lol

If some one prominent in an industry SELLS his share to THE BIGGEST EVENT in the Industry annually it does make ya wanna go HUH???</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ben I have to agree with 4Given&#8230;sorry $Given&#8230; you are now forever soiled!! lol</p>
<p>If some one prominent in an industry SELLS his share to THE BIGGEST EVENT in the Industry annually it does make ya wanna go HUH???</p>
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		<title>By: 4Given</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894379</link>
		<dc:creator>4Given</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 02:24:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894379</guid>
		<description>What makes the comment about Fowler off base??? I do agree that These labels (And Radio) just do not seem to know what the audience wants to hear. I buy a CD  and there is a song that me and other people think would make a great single... But the song never gets singled, meanwhile the one that does dies out pretty quick. This is just IMHO but since everyone seems to have one I thought I would share mine...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What makes the comment about Fowler off base??? I do agree that These labels (And Radio) just do not seem to know what the audience wants to hear. I buy a CD  and there is a song that me and other people think would make a great single&#8230; But the song never gets singled, meanwhile the one that does dies out pretty quick. This is just IMHO but since everyone seems to have one I thought I would share mine&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Harris</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894036</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Harris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 18:55:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-894036</guid>
		<description>The comment about Scott Fowler I believe is way off base. Most SG radio and SG labels don't have a clue what the SG audience really wants. They keep pushing progressive hard, while the audience continues to dwindle. Give the audience what it wants and the rest of this will fall in place. SG management has and is doing a horrible job or knowing their audience.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The comment about Scott Fowler I believe is way off base. Most SG radio and SG labels don&#8217;t have a clue what the SG audience really wants. They keep pushing progressive hard, while the audience continues to dwindle. Give the audience what it wants and the rest of this will fall in place. SG management has and is doing a horrible job or knowing their audience.</p>
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		<title>By: Leadsinger</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893805</link>
		<dc:creator>Leadsinger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 03:03:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893805</guid>
		<description>That's a great move for both Marsh and Daywind... and on topic I echo David Bruce Murray's thoughts...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a great move for both Marsh and Daywind&#8230; and on topic I echo David Bruce Murray&#8217;s thoughts&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: GVBFAN08</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893430</link>
		<dc:creator>GVBFAN08</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 19:34:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893430</guid>
		<description>WOW - Marshall Hall signed with Daywind!  I just got this via facebook!

http://www.gospelmusicupdate.com/_news/marshallhallsignswithdaywindrecords.shtm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WOW - Marshall Hall signed with Daywind!  I just got this via facebook!</p>
<p><a href="http://www.gospelmusicupdate.com/_news/marshallhallsignswithdaywindrecords.shtm" rel="nofollow">http://www.gospelmusicupdate.com/_news/marshallhallsignswithdaywindrecords.shtm</a></p>
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		<title>By: David Bruce Murray</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893400</link>
		<dc:creator>David Bruce Murray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 14:57:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893400</guid>
		<description>We are increasingly moving from a society where most people look for someone else to give them a job to a society where people are forced to find creative ways to earn a living. 

That's not necessarily a bad thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We are increasingly moving from a society where most people look for someone else to give them a job to a society where people are forced to find creative ways to earn a living. </p>
<p>That&#8217;s not necessarily a bad thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893392</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 13:36:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893392</guid>
		<description>Just an observation that hasn't been made yet...

There is a sisterhood to be found in breast cancer that is seldom found in other forms.  Part of that comes from the culture's encouraging women to form the kind of connection with other women that is deeply empathic, especially in this kind of struggle.  

I am NOT a cancer survivor.  I am a volunteer with "Look Good, Feel Better" and every single time I go--I am amazed at the courage and strength these women display.  

I see janetandfriends as a place where women who need a spiritual (not secular) place to connect.  Not a bad thing, after all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just an observation that hasn&#8217;t been made yet&#8230;</p>
<p>There is a sisterhood to be found in breast cancer that is seldom found in other forms.  Part of that comes from the culture&#8217;s encouraging women to form the kind of connection with other women that is deeply empathic, especially in this kind of struggle.  </p>
<p>I am NOT a cancer survivor.  I am a volunteer with &#8220;Look Good, Feel Better&#8221; and every single time I go&#8211;I am amazed at the courage and strength these women display.  </p>
<p>I see janetandfriends as a place where women who need a spiritual (not secular) place to connect.  Not a bad thing, after all.</p>
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		<title>By: Irishlad</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893228</link>
		<dc:creator>Irishlad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 04:51:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-893228</guid>
		<description>Imagine for a moment  Ivan Parker being the male counterpart to Janet P,what direction could he take to reinvent himself? He's firmly niched himself with the purple brigade, boxed in with no where to go. Well he did tone the mullet down a bit if you call that a try at differentiation. Before i bring the wrath of some down on me he's actually a very congenial chap,just a bit old fashioned,but maybe in a smart way like Daniel O'Donnel or the Rev William McCrea.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Imagine for a moment  Ivan Parker being the male counterpart to Janet P,what direction could he take to reinvent himself? He&#8217;s firmly niched himself with the purple brigade, boxed in with no where to go. Well he did tone the mullet down a bit if you call that a try at differentiation. Before i bring the wrath of some down on me he&#8217;s actually a very congenial chap,just a bit old fashioned,but maybe in a smart way like Daniel O&#8217;Donnel or the Rev William McCrea.</p>
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		<title>By: Mickey Gamble</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892822</link>
		<dc:creator>Mickey Gamble</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 18:47:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892822</guid>
		<description>First, Thanks to Doug and (most) others here for engaging this discussion. I think it is beginning to dawn on more and more of the Southern Gospel community just how much has changed and just how much change is going to be required.

Probably a few of the readers here are aware that we, at Crossroads, have been pretty deep in sorting out a lot of this for 2-3 years now and are beginning to put a number of concepts and the tools that go with them into place. So, just for the fun of discussion on these subjects, I'll throw out a few things to think about. And some of this may be a bit sideways from Doug's analysis. Anyway, here goes with 3 related topics:

1.  On Tribes.  Orthodox (if I can call it that) tribal social theory from the late 1990's proposes that tribal groupings are in fact a "new" social phenomenon with no antecedents which have appeared precisely as a result of the breakdown of more solid and permanent social groupings that, in their own turn, grew out of the breakdown of the the strength and security of the extended family even earlier in the 20th century. Tribes are the current reaction to the enhanced alienation and disconnectedness inherent in the culture brought about by too many factors to talk about here. But, they (tribes) are qualitatively less structured, more focused, more temporary and, therefore, less stable than any previous cultural "attempts" to overcome individual isolation.  The fanatic and continuous Cathedral fan of the 1980's and 90's is not the same as "followers" of janetandfriends who move in and out of the community as their day-to-day conditions change. A tribe that grows around a certain viral video may last just a few days but a fleeting "community" exists among those who are sharing the delight of passing it around.
Tribes are extremely ephemeral unless some personality or other force moves in such a way to "lead", organize, and/or extend the communal experience that pleases the individuals in the tribe. And there is absolutely no guarantee that this can be consciously done. Tribal loyalty is so "light" and suspicion so thorough that any hint of manipulation can be cause for immediate evaporation. 

So we have all this "background" to any attempt to "exploit" the situation and turn the phenomena into "tribal marketing." Not easy. But possible. It requires first and foremost and understanding of this background. And that is just going to be hard for some in the SG world. And then, it requires a level of authenticity to which we are not accustomed in this business. And then, it requires a level of "conversation" to which we are not accustomed. And then, there is the "know thyself" part.  Do I even know what my own vision for my life creation is and does that have the juice to even attract tribal followings?  Can I trade the notion of ubiquitous fame for niche, but effective, fame. Testing out and comparing what I want to be doing as an artist with the desires of a "potential" tribe is an ongoing creative process.

2.  On Music.  Doug seems to make the case (or fear) that tribal products can take precedence over attention to music. Inspiration from the music leads fan and artist to shift into getting inspiration from the other "products" which leads to a disinterest in the quality of the music on the part of both the artist and the fan.  I would argue that in fact this is not a straight line sequence ending with ancillary products and other endeavors but a circle which leads the artist back to more intense and passionate musical creation based on the informed connections between the artist and tribal conversations. Since Doug correctly places the initial inspiration as coming from the music, I would agree and say further that if this goes away, so do all the other artist's endeavors. The "celebrity" connection is always first and foremost, the music. Musical artistry remains the core of the process--it  simply may be informed and funded differently.

3.  Disintermediation.  While I agree that it would appear that such a "scattering" is indeed inherent in the current directions, it is extremely important to remember that we are in the midst of (rather than at the end of) a paradigm shift. I would preach often and long here that all these cool new concepts and tools are in a constant state of experimentation, shift, and change. None of them may be useful even a year from now. We do have a tendency to desire a new permanence that may or may not be forthcoming. Seth Godin talks (very sketchily) about a concept he calls "silos of tribes" which may indicate or point to a renewed aggregation of some sort. In music, that could end up being some kind of realignment of large scale groupings around something more like "experience" than genres. And, personally, I do think we will get to something like that. Sometime. But until then it is probably going to be as you said "Every man for himself."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First, Thanks to Doug and (most) others here for engaging this discussion. I think it is beginning to dawn on more and more of the Southern Gospel community just how much has changed and just how much change is going to be required.</p>
<p>Probably a few of the readers here are aware that we, at Crossroads, have been pretty deep in sorting out a lot of this for 2-3 years now and are beginning to put a number of concepts and the tools that go with them into place. So, just for the fun of discussion on these subjects, I&#8217;ll throw out a few things to think about. And some of this may be a bit sideways from Doug&#8217;s analysis. Anyway, here goes with 3 related topics:</p>
<p>1.  On Tribes.  Orthodox (if I can call it that) tribal social theory from the late 1990&#8217;s proposes that tribal groupings are in fact a &#8220;new&#8221; social phenomenon with no antecedents which have appeared precisely as a result of the breakdown of more solid and permanent social groupings that, in their own turn, grew out of the breakdown of the the strength and security of the extended family even earlier in the 20th century. Tribes are the current reaction to the enhanced alienation and disconnectedness inherent in the culture brought about by too many factors to talk about here. But, they (tribes) are qualitatively less structured, more focused, more temporary and, therefore, less stable than any previous cultural &#8220;attempts&#8221; to overcome individual isolation.  The fanatic and continuous Cathedral fan of the 1980&#8217;s and 90&#8217;s is not the same as &#8220;followers&#8221; of janetandfriends who move in and out of the community as their day-to-day conditions change. A tribe that grows around a certain viral video may last just a few days but a fleeting &#8220;community&#8221; exists among those who are sharing the delight of passing it around.<br />
Tribes are extremely ephemeral unless some personality or other force moves in such a way to &#8220;lead&#8221;, organize, and/or extend the communal experience that pleases the individuals in the tribe. And there is absolutely no guarantee that this can be consciously done. Tribal loyalty is so &#8220;light&#8221; and suspicion so thorough that any hint of manipulation can be cause for immediate evaporation. </p>
<p>So we have all this &#8220;background&#8221; to any attempt to &#8220;exploit&#8221; the situation and turn the phenomena into &#8220;tribal marketing.&#8221; Not easy. But possible. It requires first and foremost and understanding of this background. And that is just going to be hard for some in the SG world. And then, it requires a level of authenticity to which we are not accustomed in this business. And then, it requires a level of &#8220;conversation&#8221; to which we are not accustomed. And then, there is the &#8220;know thyself&#8221; part.  Do I even know what my own vision for my life creation is and does that have the juice to even attract tribal followings?  Can I trade the notion of ubiquitous fame for niche, but effective, fame. Testing out and comparing what I want to be doing as an artist with the desires of a &#8220;potential&#8221; tribe is an ongoing creative process.</p>
<p>2.  On Music.  Doug seems to make the case (or fear) that tribal products can take precedence over attention to music. Inspiration from the music leads fan and artist to shift into getting inspiration from the other &#8220;products&#8221; which leads to a disinterest in the quality of the music on the part of both the artist and the fan.  I would argue that in fact this is not a straight line sequence ending with ancillary products and other endeavors but a circle which leads the artist back to more intense and passionate musical creation based on the informed connections between the artist and tribal conversations. Since Doug correctly places the initial inspiration as coming from the music, I would agree and say further that if this goes away, so do all the other artist&#8217;s endeavors. The &#8220;celebrity&#8221; connection is always first and foremost, the music. Musical artistry remains the core of the process&#8211;it  simply may be informed and funded differently.</p>
<p>3.  Disintermediation.  While I agree that it would appear that such a &#8220;scattering&#8221; is indeed inherent in the current directions, it is extremely important to remember that we are in the midst of (rather than at the end of) a paradigm shift. I would preach often and long here that all these cool new concepts and tools are in a constant state of experimentation, shift, and change. None of them may be useful even a year from now. We do have a tendency to desire a new permanence that may or may not be forthcoming. Seth Godin talks (very sketchily) about a concept he calls &#8220;silos of tribes&#8221; which may indicate or point to a renewed aggregation of some sort. In music, that could end up being some kind of realignment of large scale groupings around something more like &#8220;experience&#8221; than genres. And, personally, I do think we will get to something like that. Sometime. But until then it is probably going to be as you said &#8220;Every man for himself.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: soldier</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892820</link>
		<dc:creator>soldier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 18:02:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892820</guid>
		<description>#5 JC, right on. 

DH has so much potential.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#5 JC, right on. </p>
<p>DH has so much potential.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892758</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 14:31:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892758</guid>
		<description>This is a superb analysis of what's going on . . . I only wish we could have a better grasp of where things are going!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a superb analysis of what&#8217;s going on . . . I only wish we could have a better grasp of where things are going!</p>
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		<title>By: JC</title>
		<link>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892740</link>
		<dc:creator>JC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 12:08:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://averyfineline.com/2009/05/11/disintermediation-pt-2/#comment-892740</guid>
		<description>Of course, things have to change, duh!  I really don't believe Janet was looking to get cancer, so that she could embrace this "new" form of marketing.  Actually, that is quite ridiculous.  She more than likely, like the Christian lady that she is, saw a need and wanted to help those with the same burdens she had and God had brought her through.  Maybe Scott Fowler, after Roger's passing didn't have enough time to dedicate to NQC, maybe he needed to manage his group.  Doug, you speak of one with knowledge but the truth is your words are hollow.  You so sadly want the church that you have abandoned to embrace your lifestyle, that you tear down parts of Christian culture that you say you love just to make yourself feel better.  How about taking some time with the God these people talk about, instead of relying on your God-given writing talents, and really seeking Him out.  I do not doubt that you have been hurt in the past by the church, but the only time that it feels that God is hurting you if when you are not walking with Him.
How did I get all of that from your latest post, I didn't.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course, things have to change, duh!  I really don&#8217;t believe Janet was looking to get cancer, so that she could embrace this &#8220;new&#8221; form of marketing.  Actually, that is quite ridiculous.  She more than likely, like the Christian lady that she is, saw a need and wanted to help those with the same burdens she had and God had brought her through.  Maybe Scott Fowler, after Roger&#8217;s passing didn&#8217;t have enough time to dedicate to NQC, maybe he needed to manage his group.  Doug, you speak of one with knowledge but the truth is your words are hollow.  You so sadly want the church that you have abandoned to embrace your lifestyle, that you tear down parts of Christian culture that you say you love just to make yourself feel better.  How about taking some time with the God these people talk about, instead of relying on your God-given writing talents, and really seeking Him out.  I do not doubt that you have been hurt in the past by the church, but the only time that it feels that God is hurting you if when you are not walking with Him.<br />
How did I get all of that from your latest post, I didn&#8217;t.</p>
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